Curse

Servant of Kali · Dec 31, 2006, 06:50 PM // 18:50

(yes im aware that others suggested this before, but it wasnt enough i guess)

OK before flaming, lemme explain.

The reason why everyone says we can have max 3 heroes is social aspect; ie "one is forced then to team up with at least one real player" blablabla.

But, has anyone actually thought of this?

Let's put it this way. When i decide to do mission with PUGs, i do the mission with pugs. When i decide to do something alone, i do it alone. I dont put 3 heroes + 1 pug with his 3 heroes. I put 3 heroes and the rest henchies. The limit on heroes is NOT making me pug more. It's just more annoying when i need to do certain things like skill capping myself, alone.

The second reason why there is a limit of 3 heroes might be... well, overpowerdness. Let's face it, a homemade 7 heroes beat 99% of PUGs out there. True, but 3 heroes + 4 henchies still beat 98% of PUGs out there. So, even this reason is... false, the way i see it. If PUGs seem too.... unprofessional to do some mission, i can do it with heroes + henchies. But it would have been much easier and funnier for me to do with with 7 heroes.

Pro-7heroes:
1) Fun. Creativity. I can actually have my own team builds in PvE. Awesome. Sure, AI limits it somewhat, but it's better than using henchie bars which are as awful as monster skill bars. Note: this would not make me pug less, because i dont play online game to solo everything. It would simply make it easier when i do have to play solo because there aint enough people in the district or no one wants to do what i want to do
2) Power. Efficiency. I can clean the area faster with 7 heroes instead of those horrible henchies (still, note that henchies are more efficient than avg pug). This saves time. And time is money.
3) Option. Yes, people like to have option. It's good to have it, even if you dont use it. There's just some good feeling around that.

Vermilion · Dec 31, 2006, 07:58 PM // 19:58

/signed

I've had just about enough of dealing with henchies. :/

Samuel Dravis · Dec 31, 2006, 08:05 PM // 20:05

Make all the henchies Heroes. Finally Cynn would not friggan cast firestorm.

Frostbite Yo · Dec 31, 2006, 08:08 PM // 20:08

Quote:

Originally Posted by pigdestroyer

ok, the heroes screwed any interaction there was ever in guild wars PVE, you simply dont see any LFG messages anymore, if you retards want to get throught the game like antisocial nerds you are, you should of get an offline rpg, thanks.

/not signed

Agreed, sure i can beat the game with a full party of hench's and hero's and i did, but i didnt have much fun at it, a full party is much for fun than a full group of hero's

/not signed

Zinger314 · Dec 31, 2006, 08:08 PM // 20:08

That would make PvE too easy, as if it wasn't easy enough.

/notsigned

Vinraith · Dec 31, 2006, 08:09 PM // 20:09

Edit: Upon further contemplation, the balance issues have pretty much swayed me against this one. The runes and weapons are the main issue here. What might work better, then, is if you had an alterable, abbreviated skill bar for henchmen. Say, 4 or 6 slots that you could change out as with heroes, and no equipment options for them at all.

To the idea as presented, then:

/notsigned

lyra_song · Dec 31, 2006, 08:09 PM // 20:09

/not signed .-.

oh jesus....this game is sooo easy already...

i did hells precipice with hero/hench and killed without much trouble

Servant of Kali · Dec 31, 2006, 08:09 PM // 20:09

Quote:

Originally Posted by pigdestroyer

f you retards want to get throught the game like antisocial nerds you are

Yes we want to, thank you. When i encounter people like you, how can i be anything other than anti-social?

ps: If you were smarter than you are, you wouldn't even reply in this thread. If you want heroes out of the game completely, you can create a thread of your own. The point of this thread is that, since we already do have heroes, and they are part of the game, why not increase the limit to 7? If i want to play with henchies n heroes i'll play, if i want to play with henchies alone i'll play, as i played before. Hero limit does nothing but annoy.

pps: thanks again for proving my point, you attitude is the reason why my heroes > pugs

ppps: yes i like to play online game and socialize, it's just that im picky. So, when i have to choose between you and a hero, i'll take hero. But when there's some cool pug, i'll take pug and enjoy the company.

AW Lore · Dec 31, 2006, 08:19 PM // 20:19

/signed even though is highly unlikely it will come true.

it would be too good to be true, but one can dream.

T N Player · Dec 31, 2006, 08:29 PM // 20:29

/not signed

no would ever use other ppl again. plus it would be too strong. there r a lot of ppl already mad at the fact that heros take up space in mission so this would just make it worse

Meralda estat · Dec 31, 2006, 08:46 PM // 20:46

/signed so that i dont need to deal whit all the bloody ...... ppl that can get this game for 10$ and destory my time!
Sure there are ppl "I" wand to play whit. tho let ME deside if i want to play whit Humes or whit AI or whas this a komunist game?

Laenavesse · Dec 31, 2006, 08:49 PM // 20:49

/signed

And now for the testimonial and reason why (skip if wish.):

o-o i like playing with people (I mainly got the game because my boyfriend got it for me and we play together

) and I've made some friends on the game but they're not always around. I had to solo most everything in nightfall and factions with my assassin (well just being a sin explains why. *huggles her poor unloved sin*) and though i did pretty well with just the 3 heroes and henches, once i got to the realm of torment it reeaaaallly would have been nice to be able to stick in my Jin in there so she could help with interrupting or bleeding or poisioning those stupid torments. The heroes I usually used were tahl, zhed, and olias. then henchwise some tank, more monks, and then cynn or something.

i did party whenever i could, though, for like missions or if some random person wanted help and i was bored and it is more fun with people (as long as you get the *right* people...).

However, having the extra 4 heroes would be uuuuber nice o_o just so i can have more control and have more options. I had to hench the Battle of Turai since no one else was doing it. Took foreeevveeerrr >_> I know it can be done and I know there are several ways but I'm too lazy to look up every possible tactic (there were actually NONE when I did it...NF was still newish when i got there). I also had to figure out the Bonus of Crossroads mission by myself back then because this was the time guildwiki was down and i hadn't known about Guild Wars Guru and people kept thinking the last two Opressors were the last two that actually finished the mission -_-;;

So yeah, as much fun as it can be to party with people, it can also be very annoying when you wind up with people who don't know and don't listen to other people (i kept telling them but nooooo...). Of course NOW there wouldn't be any problems since NF has been here for a longer time and guildwiki is up and stuff here.

You also don't find many people wanting to do the quests with people. There was never a big surge for it to begin with o_o The main places you find PUGs is in missions rather than random outposts. Yeah there are people who want to party with people, but that doesn't mean the vast majority though.

And this is in the view of someone who has to play by himself/herself when no one else around. The game was designed for both the solo and group player (s'why we had henches in the first place) so if we have the heroes already, why not go ahead and make it so we can HERO it all the way, rather than hero/hench.

It's not like you don't ever have the option to party with people. There are probably people who hero/hench the whole game only anyway.

Oh and about the level of difficulty of the campaigns, I will say I died less in NF (no stupid putrid explosions >_>) but I think the level of difficulty is more of a player perspective then it just is. If that makes sense. Some people find it easy, some people find it hard. It will definitely be harder for someone who just started Guild Wars on Nightfall. I think having 7 heroes is more for the veteran player who knows the ropes. Plus it's kinna fun being able to understand other classes without having to play it. I made an Ele because of my hero nukers xD

And there's my dollar's worth of stuff. I doubt this'll happen and I doubt that if it does people will party less. If they do, ANET will probably revert back to the 3 Hero system.

So nothing to lose IMO

Servant of Kali · Dec 31, 2006, 08:52 PM // 20:52

Wow incredible, are people who reply with a "no" actually read what i type? Can you provide ARGUMENTS instead of oppinions?

Zinger - u answer no to everything so i never comment your posts, neither here nor on GWO.

Oppinions:
1) "But it would make this game too easy" <= helllooo? PvE is very easy as in, someone who has trouble with PvE in this game, with henchies, will also have trouble with heroes. Using "would be too easy" as an argument here is silly, as PvE in this game is on purpose easy so that everyone can do it. Compare it to some other games and you'll know what i mean.
2) People would be more antisocial. Oh geez, how bout read the post, i already answered that. You countered it with an oppinion. Last time i checked argument>oppinion. Ty. Have a nice day.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Frostbite Yo

but i didnt have much fun at it, a full party is much for fun than a full group of hero's

Dude, are you deaf? This isnt PUGs vs Heroes thread. It's for people who use henchies instead of full heroes. Hellooo. How difficult is to understand that person who wants to use henchies will use henchies and WONT use pugs. So, instead of getting annoyed with henchies just give heroes instead. NOTHING changes. Antisocial people remain antisocial, when they want to pug they still CANT pug.

Quote:

Originally Posted by T N Player

no would ever use other ppl again

wow no way? Then how come people STILL pug? I can do so many stuff in the game with 7 henchies. So what, you still see me pugging. And tons of other people. Gimme a break. You CANT force people to Pug if they dont want to. What you can is make their non-pug experience more enjoyable. When i want to play with pugs it's because i want company and NOT because pug can do better than my henchies. No they cant. 98% PUG groups do WORSE than henchie group. I still pug. Get it? No? Whatever.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Laenavesse

You also don't find many people wanting to do the quests with people.

See, no one really cares about that. If you ask people here whether they want to quest with you, how many will you find? And how many online when you are? They are too selfish for that, but they will deny you the chance to play with heroes.

Every now and then i go to do some quest. It's especially tedious when doing primary quests which you have to. Defenders of the Forrest? Sigh... sure i LFGed for hours, but you CANT find people. So i want 7 heroes. What's bad with that? Almost every mission in Nightfall i did with PUGs. I play with PUGs when i can find them. If i could have 7 heroes i'd still PUG, but often i cant find people so i have to take henchies. Sure, there are some exceptions when i do the mission with henchies only, such as old THK, because average pug just wasnt good enough for that mission.

Agatsu · Dec 31, 2006, 08:55 PM // 20:55

/signed

Not everyone plays the game the same way.

I spend a lot of time running with heroes and henchies only and I would like the challenge of setting up my own hero team builds as I want.

To those who have posted how easy PvE is already, I would add that yes, I too have beat just about everything with henchies alone, but i would like the option to set up a team of heroes as I choose.

Loki Seiguro · Dec 31, 2006, 09:02 PM // 21:02

Quote:

Originally Posted by Samuel Dravis

Make all the henchies Heroes. Finally Cynn would not friggan cast firestorm.

lol im fine with her using fire storm you just have to find a way to keep the guys there in the aoe by either combining it with a MM olias or you or MoW and its destructive force will handle the rest.

personally im tired of people bad mouthing Fire storm and most AoE skills. If you dont know how to use it or even to fix the cons of it then dont use it but dont flame people for using it.....not that im saying you are flaming it or anything just using a general term..meaning..something.

Henchies are find to me really depends if you can control them or not as anet gave us the flags on the compass thing. As much as i would like to sign this idea i can't becuase i feel it will be to over powering. As it is only about 1 out of 10 people will play with other real players for quests and missions. Guild Wars should be more interactive but now towns are dead..no one really talks..they get there load up a couple henchies and heros and leave.

/not signed

oh before you down stab or w/e my post..i understand what you are saying but i just wanted to voice my opinion..yes there we go

FireFox · Dec 31, 2006, 09:09 PM // 21:09

bad idea, plus they'd have to change the interface

Shinjinbukai · Dec 31, 2006, 09:13 PM // 21:13

I would find it very hard to control 7 heroes as well as actualy play my character. Because when I think about it, there goes 1/2 a screen dedicated to heroes skillbar/health/mp and after that you sometimes have to micromanage, imagine trying to control 7 different heros 1 by 1. Now I know that Henchies can not be moved by themself, I kind of like this feature, because that means less managing people as much. Now I know a lot of people will say they could manage it, but, in the middle of a battle, and you know you want X hero to do this and Y to do that while Z makes a good combo and I runs away while B uses a stance etc I would find that just a little to much

So for the limit they posted on it at the begining of NF I like that, I think its the perfect number that is managable.

For my sanity only /not signed

Shinjinbukai · Dec 31, 2006, 09:13 PM // 21:13

Double post, sorry. >.>

Zinger314 · Dec 31, 2006, 09:19 PM // 21:19

Quote:

Originally Posted by Servant of Kali

Zinger - u answer no to everything so i never comment your posts, neither here nor on GWO.

Then how come lyra_song, who answers "yes" much more often than myself, said "no" for the exact same reason?

I'd think you'd be above ad hominem, Kali.

Nevertheless, it's a valid reason. Ever wonder why Henchmen don't have perfect Weapons or Runed armor? It so that PvE has some semblance of difficulty.

leoknight · Dec 31, 2006, 09:22 PM // 21:22

/signed

It will solves quite a lot problems during quest and mainly mission:

No more rejected by team abused (because you're assassin, mesmer or whatever your profession that they think someone is more important than your role)

No dealing with leaver in the middle of a mission, people being stupid aggro 2-3 groups of enemies to get your whole team kill, or someone in your team speak with an NPC even though you told them not to do it. (player failed to follow order when necessary)

No more waiting for sudden time of day where there's more people online to able to find PUG for mission, ever since Factions and Nightfall released finding a PUG can be difficult especially when you're playing at night time. (Not everyone have the time to play in the daytime except in the late night)

--------------------------------

I have question for people who do not agreed with this idea, why should we put up with such unnecessary frustration with people from the 3 common problems that I listed from above?